En otros tiempos era l cito acusar, a quienes historiaban el pasado, de consignar nicamente las gestas de los reyes Hoy d a ya no lo es, pues cada vez se investiga m s sobre lo que ellos callaron, expugnaron o simplemente ignoraron El queso y los gusanos narra la historia del molinero friulano Domenico Scandella, conocido como Menocchio, que muri en la hoguera por ordeEn otros tiempos era l cito acusar, a quienes historiaban el pasado, de consignar nicamente las gestas de los reyes Hoy d a ya no lo es, pues cada vez se investiga m s sobre lo que ellos callaron, expugnaron o simplemente ignoraron El queso y los gusanos narra la historia del molinero friulano Domenico Scandella, conocido como Menocchio, que muri en la hoguera por orden del Santo Oficio a finales del siglo XVI Mediante los expedientes del proceso inquisitorial y de otros documentos que dan cuenta de su vida, Ginzburg reconstruye un fragmento de la llamada cultura popular o cultura de las clases subalternas, condenada al ostracismo por quienes sostienen que la reintegraci n de las clases subalternas en la historia solo es posible a trav s de la demograf a y la sociolog a.
El queso y los gusanos En otros tiempos era l cito acusar a quienes historiaban el pasado de consignar nicamente las gestas de los reyes Hoy d a ya no lo es pues cada vez se investiga m s sobre lo que ellos callaron exp
Fantastic study based on trial records of a sixteenth century Italian miller charged with heresy. The book offers a glimpse into an alternative (and generally unheard from) world-view that is full of so much imagination on the part of the miller that it should put many a fiction writer to shame.That really is its strength and virtue, to be a reminder that the masses of people that now we label as Lutheran, Catholic or Anabaptist were a mess of individuals. While the beliefs of the hierarchies ca [...]
Non dite di conoscere l’Italia, se non siete mai andati a mangiare in trattoria.Partiamo col dire che non è un ricettario a base di prodotti caseari, tramandato dai nostri avi. Quindi abbandonate il grembiule e mettetevi comodi.Ma non troppo comodi, scordatevi l’amaca e il mojito in mano. Piuttosto scrittoio e appunti, preceduti dalla visione di qualche vecchia cassetta di “Un giorno in pretura”.Trattasi infatti degli atti realtivi a un processo giudiziario del ‘500.Scordatevi però c [...]
The Cheese and the Worms is a ground breaking exposé into the field of microhistory and remains a foundational work for historians today. Ginzberg used the story of Menocchio, a sixteenth century miller who was twice prosecuted and ultimately condemned by the inquisition for holding and preaching egregiously heretical beliefs. As a miller and a literate man, Menocchio had a greater exposure to people and ideas than the average peasant-farmer, and apparently also a keen intellect which he used t [...]
As a medievalist, I run across this book all the time, which is funny considering it's not really a medieval book (it's more Renaissance/early modern). It's made a huge splash in The Study of Old Things, though, so I'm not surprised it finally showed up in a class of mine on the reading list.So, the gist of the story (and it really does read like a story, which is kind of neat) is Ginzburg following the trials by the inquisition (no, not the one you didn't expect, another one) of a miller for be [...]
this guy goes on for 150+ pages about ALL the possible explanations for this random peasant thinking that the world was formed from chaos like the way cheese coagulates. then he's like the collective unconscious is an "unacceptable" explanation like wtf this whole book is dumb and this guy wasted his time writing it and the translators wasted their time translating it. it's literally written like "well the miller may have gotten his ideas from THIS SMALL, FAR OFF CHRISTIAN EXTREMIST GROUP becaus [...]
This book is so hyped in academic circles, that it was perhaps setting itself up as a disappointment before I even cracked it open. I'm sure for the right type of history major (that is, one that's interested in actual events in history rather than their theoretical importance) this is a revelation. For me, it was more boring than I care to admit. I couldn't care about the miller Menocchio anymore than I care about any other random individual on the street. Sure, he was uncommonly literate, and [...]
This is a microhistory of a sixteenth century Italian miller, whose heretical beliefs brought him to the attention of the Inquisition. Ginzburg uses the records of his trial to examine his personal theology and cosmology, and to examine to what extent we can recover a pre-modern "popular culture." I thought it was a more sophisticated attempt at a microhistory than The Return of Martin Guerre; Ginzburg approaches his sources with more subtlety and with more awareness of the dangers of pre-concei [...]
Questo libro è stata una sorpresa.L'ho preso in mano perché avevo partecipato ad un incontro con il regista Alberto Fasulo e lui avevo parlato del suo prossimo progetto cinematografico, appunto un film sul Menocchio. Il nome mi era familiare perché, tutto sommato, vivo ad una quindicina di chilometri da Montereale; ma non avevo la minima idea di cosa avesse combinato per essere ricordato a cinquecento anni di distanza.Fasulo ha cominciato il suo racconto citando un articolo di The New Yorker, [...]
Replace the theology department with 'Cheese and Worms' studies.
Ok, I'm leaving the rating at 3,5 stars. I really enjoyed this book, the first half of it especially. We had Mijail Bajtin and Rabelais, the juxtaposition between popular culture and high-dominant culture. The only reasonable explanation, in my opinion, is that Menocchio was: either from the future a la Outlander or, he was Socrates resuscitated. Who knows? I don't. But if I ever have a dog I'm naming him Menocchio, I bet he'll be a pain in the ass, judging everything I say. Or perhaps I'll name [...]
This mirco-history concerns the life and times of one Domenico Scandella, a miller known as 'Menocchio', who was put on trial during the Inquisition for conceiving of and promulgating a blasphemous cosmos in a town of the north-eastern Italian state of Friuli. The central metaphor of his cosmic fantasy is 'the cheese and the worms', or, more to the point, the relationship between the cheese and its 'spontaneous generation' of worms.Menocchio was a literate peasant (a rarity) so it's tempting to [...]
This book, emblematic of the sub-genre of microhistory, is actually two stories simultaneously playing out on two levels. On the most obvious level, it follows the life and troubles of an early-modern Italian miller, Menocchio. Menocchio spent most of his life as both an idiosyncratic heretic and a well-respected member of his community. He came up against the Roman Inquisition multiple times, resulting in several imprisonments and eventually his execution. The second level of this book is Ginzb [...]
Though not my typical pick, this book (read for my Honors class) demonstrates the immense hypocrisy of the Catholic Church during the Baroque Period. As a miller in an isolated village in Italy (Montereale), a literate peasant explores the elements of Christianity with an unwittingly pantheistic bend. His conclusions range from being considered Lutheran, Anabaptist, atheist, Muslim, pantheist, and pagan. Despite his anomalous approach to religion his village finds him an amiable personality, fai [...]
Carlo Ginzburg looks at detailed records from the Roman Inquisition trial of a sixteenth century miller named Menocchio whose heresies include the rejection of the divinity of Christ, the rejection of the idea of Virgin Birth, and an interesting cosmogony in which in the beginning all was chaos out of which emerged a mass "just as cheese is made out of milk--and worms appeared in it, and these were the angels, and among that number of angels there was also God, he too having been created out of [...]
I've never had the pleasure of reading about such a well-documented life of any regular person that had lived before the 1800s before, and I thoroughly enjoyed it. There is something beautifully egalitarian about the very idea of such an approach, but what makes the book truly fascinating is Ginzburg's ability to paint an image of the wider early Modern peasant society based on this story of a single person. The period he works with is particularly apt for such explorations of individuals, speci [...]
Facinating book, but Ginzburg over-reaches. There are many reasons why Menocchio may believe what he seems to believe. He may not have actually read the books he says he did. He may not have understood what he was reading very well due to limited literacy or not being able to read the dialect his books were in. All these are more likely than Menocchio tapping into a primeval Indo-European peasant tradition of pantheism untouched by Roman or Christian religion. A classic but ultimately a failed e [...]
This is one of those books that gets talked up by history professors, etc, but also comes in for some criticism of the academic sort that I just don’t care about. I liked it all right. The subject matter – and the subject himself (Domenico Scandella, a miller who was burned at the stake as a heretic in the 16th century) is fascinating. But there’s a relative dearth of information on the trial and the man, and Ginzburg gets to repeating himself a lot. For a more compelling historical biogra [...]
What an incredible book! Really one of the best books I've read in grad school so far, or at least the one I've had the most enthusiastic response to. The meta-argument of this book -- that an unremarkable individual can be studied as a microcosm of the community they lived in -- is central to my job and the museum education program that I run. So frankly it was very inspiring to read such a groundbreaking model!
Genuinely deserving of the hype, Ginzburg uses unearthed Inquisition records, made after the Lutheran rebellion, to investigate the unique heresies of a simple miller.Taking his time, Ginzburg unearths elements of a peasant oral culture that is largely unrecorded except in Inquisition records. A great book all around, and highly recommended.
A really fascinating book, and I'd guess that would still be true even if you're not usually a big history reader. There are certainly pros and cons to a microhistory like this, but in any case it's a great opportunity to get little glimpses of a non-noble (or at least mostly non-noble) perspective. Menocchio is a wonderful guy to read about, alternately audacious and very sad.
I absolutely love the idea of giving voice to the voiceless, illuminating peasant culture, and "extend[ing] the historic concept of the 'individual' in the direction of the lower classes." But the subject that Ginzburg chose, the singular Mennochio, really doesn't have enough evidence about his life to back up all this extrapolation. That makes it all just seem like tenuous speculation. Bummer.
Id pair this with "The Faithful Executioner" for the reader who's interested in seeing how carefree life was for the peasantry during and after the renaissance.
Carlo Ginzburg dives into a different kind of history than the one we may be used to in his 1976 book The Cheese and the Worms. Ginzburg uses various sources and trial records of a man known as Menocchio, to show a mentality different from the mainstream popular mentality of others like him at his time. What Ginzburg uncovers through his discovery is a well read and incredibly interesting man who worked as a miller in the popular culture of Italy in the 16th century, and resisted the ideas of t [...]
Fascinating method. Ginzburg uses inquisition documentation to reveal the oral and textual roots of a 16th century heretic. The author wants to show how we might be able to grasp peasant culture in the period without being restricted by upper-class representations of the poor. The conclusion is that there was a significant amount of intellectual syncretism among clever villagers who read available books through their own interpretive lenses, and that there was even an amount of "oral" or popular [...]
Essa é a segunda obra que leio do bom e velho Ginzburg. Diferentemente da primeira, em que ele monta uma série de pequenos quebra cabeças para formar a figura maior do paganismo e da heresia na Europa Medieval, neste livro o autor foca na história de Domennego Scandella, um moleiro de um vila esquecida no norte da Itália, que por conta de sua curiosidade e capacidade de leitura, se envolve numa longa e dolorosa confusão com o Tribunal do Santo Ofício. A partir dos relatos de um momento pa [...]
My first micro-history. How Ginzburg constructs Mennochio's story based on archival trial records is amazing. Like many readers, I'm intrigued by the idea of a mediating oral tradition "deeply rooted in the European countryside" that explains "the tenacious presence of a peasant religion intolerant of dogma and ritual, tied to the cycles of nature, and fundamentally pre-Christian" (p. 112). However, as Ginzburg acknowledges in footnote 58: "It's legitimate to object that the hypothesis that trac [...]
Blind Alley?: The books meanings were distorted by Menocchio. His oral culture was the filter for all of his reading* Temple of the Virgins: Example of a detail in a book becoming the central issue for Menocchio* Funeral of the Madonna: Again Menocchio overemphasizes the dishonor of Mary and misinterprets the story* The Father of Christ: Menocchio focuses of Joseph being the father of Christ.* Judgment Day: Menocchio believes that mans relationship to man is more important than his relationship [...]
E começamos mais um mês e mais um tema do Desafio Literário 2011. Os livros que escolhi dessa vez passam todos pelo mesmo tema e, claro, não se trata de uma coincidência: investigações históricas.Iniciamos então com o pé direito, com o absolutamente delicioso O Queijo e os Vermes de Carlo Ginzburg. Esse livro está na minha lista de leituras desde a época do colégio, continuou lá durante a faculdade e esperou ainda mais um pouco até que um belo dia chega um pacote da Régis com ele [...]
Aside from very positive reviews, one of the reasons I read this book is that Menocchio (the book's central character) lived about 30 kilometers from my hometown (which could logically be the "unknown place in Carnia" where he was exiled). And when reading the premises of the book (a world coagulating like cheese, and God and the Angels being worms), as well as the first chapters, I was expecting Menocchio to come out like some of our well loved but often mocked village originals, loudly proclai [...]
This is an absolutely fascinating account of the two trials of a sixteenth century Miller by the Inquisition. The Miller comes up with a strange admixture of an world view, a materialist one, which reflects the Pre-Christian ideas alongside very modern ones. The book traces the origins and evolution of these ideas, looking into the books that the Miller was reading and the conversations that were going all around him, and in so doing, presents a microcosm of peasant life, ideas and conversations [...]